Standby power consumption

[Kuschelmonschter]

I started to measure power consumption in standby with an EdiMax SP-2101W and FHEM software.

First test I have done is with optimized settings like:

Remote start: disabled

Automatic software downloading: disabled

There are easily 50-100 wake-ups per night which might sooner or later upset the PSU.

At least with those optimized settings, it went to deep sleep for the first time about half an hour after switching off the set (going from ~20W to 0.5W).

This test was done with the antenna cable unplugged. It might very well be that the TV therefore fails to update the EPG/services, retrying every X minutes.

@Anonymous @Peter_S. Maybe you guys can find something out about Sony standby behavior? That does not look too healthy...

Next night I will try with antenna cable plugged in.

[Jecht_Sin]

I thought about that indeed. But with Remote Start active the network interfaces are down so I suppose Bonjour in my case shouldn't matter. I disabled the Remote Start anyway. The Ethernet interface still goes up immediately after switching the TV on (with the ping going off after few minutes). So I decided I'll leave it as it is now.

[Kuschelmonschter]

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Jecht_Sin schrieb:

I thought about that indeed. But with Remote Start active the network interfaces are down so I suppose Bonjour in my case shouldn't matter.

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How do you think do Chromecast or Video&TV SideView app boot your TV from deep sleep? Because that is exactly what Remote start is for.

[Jecht_Sin]

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Kuschelmonschter wrote:

How do you think do Chromecast or Video&TV SideView app boot your TV from deep sleep? Because that is exactly what Remote start is for.

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Honestly I am not sure about anything anymore. My understanding was that it (should) works as follow:

• Remote Starts enabled makes the television broadcasting a message "Hey I am available for wake up via LAN!", every some seconds (thus - only partially - waking the TV/Network interface ar regular intervals)
• Bonjour in the Mac (or your NAS) should simply listen to (sniff) those messages. They act as clients
• It collects the info for all services avalable
• If an app needs to manage a specific service it gets from Bonjour the list of devices where that service is enabled

So, unless a Bonjour client sends a command to the TV, this should go back to sleep after sending the broadcast.But your charts shows that there must be some interactions between the NAS and the TV when this should be sleeping. When the NAS is down the TV wakes up less frequently.

So, if this is the logic, nope, I don't understand. I downloaded a Bonjour Browser for my Mac and tried to do some tests. But with Remote Starts enabled the ethernet interface now was mostly on (while it was dead even after turning the TV on with "Scanning Always Available" ON). The least it happens is that with Remote Start ON the TV takes longer to go to sleep (or at least to turn off the network). So it's hard to test with the few tools I have available.

Maybe I'll test it again later. I'll enable Remote Start again and go to lunch. Hoepfully that should give it enough time to enter sleep.

Another thing: have you tried reducing the scale in your charts (to like one hour) for your tests with Remote Start enabled? As it is it's too dense, it's hard to determine which is the time interval the TV wakes up.

[Kuschelmonschter]

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Another thing: have you tried reducing the scale in your charts (to like one hour) for your tests with Remote Start enabled? As it is it's too dense, it's hard to determine which is the time interval the TV wakes up.

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Sure. I have all the raw data, so I can scale it however I want. Here is 1 hour with a tic every 5 minutes:

[Jecht_Sin]

So it's about 3-6 times every 5 minutes. Once every 1 or 2 minutes. Even if it lasts 10 seconds (but I believe less, you should reduce the scale even more, to 5 minutes ) it should consume no more than an extra 3W per hour (16,67% of 19W). If that's so it seems to me in the norm after all. Although I don't understand at all why with the NAS off the sleeping time interval gets larger.

PS: In any case my ethernet interface now, with Remote Start ON, doesn't seem to go down. I know it did in some other tests. Unless that was the exception and Remote Start to work always needs the network interface on (which would make sense otherwise it could take a minute or more to switch on the TV remotely, I suppose. I kinda hate the Deep Sleep, too complicated. Sony itself took ages to implement it in the PS4).

[Kuschelmonschter]

I don't mind so much about power consumption, but more that such behavior might sooner or later upset the PSU. Also keep in mind that those wake-ups create all kinds of bad behavior on those TV, see all standby bugs in my bug list.

[Jecht_Sin]

Oh, I well know about the odd behaviours when waking up. The VPN bug is always reproducible. From the logcat it seems that's simply due to a buffer overflow in the Mediatek's libc libraries.

It isn't the wake up per se, its the system code that's messed up. How it couldn't be otherwise, since any OS reboot (without superuser/root access) is caused by broken kernel/OS themselves. But Sony blamed on me the third party developers... I tried to explain that even without any VPN the TVs may reboot during sleep, and fixing that bug could possibily affects the random reboots, but it was like talking to a wall. But it is also true that eventually Sony collected some data for the random reboots, and no OS update has been delivered since then, so hopefully they worked on it. After all this time Sony is better delivering a major bug fix when the time comes, because otherwise it would be inexcusable. I bought this TV as a networked media player (with display) not to watch.. TV.

[Garymjh]

Ok, so trying to summarise this. Ip control will stop the endless wake ups but the tv doesn't enter sleep at all. Disabling all auto updates for tv and Google play may help but probably doesn't. Disabling all Google app syncing may help. Removing Google account may help. Disabling the overnight epg updates may also help. 

I've disabled all syncing and automatic updating completely as well as epg updates. I haven't removed my Google account as this is a bit drastic and I'd have to sign up to Google every time I wanted to check for app updates. I'll see if the disabling of Google and sony app updates and syncing makes any difference overnight. 

Couple of questions. Did I read it correctly that even unplugging the Ethernet cable won't stop the endless internet wake ups? I'm not sure how that's possible. 

Do we know for sure if these constant wake ups actually do have any damaging effect?

Sony's claim that this is normal behaviour. Do Samsung lg and Panasonic have a similar endless wake up issue in standby? (Especially Panasonic as they also run android tv) 

Thanks

[Kuschelmonschter]

Nothing actually fixes the wake-ups. IP Control simply does not make the TV deep sleep at all. So it will constantly draw ~20W. Unplugging LAN and disabling WLAN made wake-ups occur less.

I don't know about others as I only have a Sony. Panasonic does not run Android TV at all. Philips does. Some guy on German communities states that he measured Philips Android TV and it did not wake up.

Concerning the harm, I only know that on German communities there have been quite some reports lately about dying power supplies. I am a software engineer rather than an electrical one...

[Garymjh]

Ok thanks. But surely pulling the Ethernet cable out will at least stop it?